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	<title>Comments on: I hate to do this, but&#8230;</title>
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	<link>http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/</link>
	<description>No authority but G-d</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 10:58:52 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: xisnotx</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28873</link>
		<dc:creator>xisnotx</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Apr 2008 22:35:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28873</guid>
		<description>http://www.btselem.org/English/Accountability/Investigatin_of_Complaints.asp
From the beginning of the current intifada (29 September 2000) to 14 February 2007, the Military Police investigated only 239 cases involving shooting by soldiers. Only 30 of these investigations resulted in the filing of indictments. During this period, 3,963 Palestinians were killed, among them 814 minors (under the age of 18).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.btselem.org/English/Accountability/Investigatin_of_Complaints.asp" rel="nofollow">http://www.btselem.org/English.....laints.asp</a><br />
From the beginning of the current intifada (29 September 2000) to 14 February 2007, the Military Police investigated only 239 cases involving shooting by soldiers. Only 30 of these investigations resulted in the filing of indictments. During this period, 3,963 Palestinians were killed, among them 814 minors (under the age of 18).</p>
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		<title>By: Mobius</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28855</link>
		<dc:creator>Mobius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Apr 2008 21:25:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28855</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;The IDF has had hundreds of court-martials and scores of jail sentences against its own soldiers for shootings against civilians since 2000. Every single shooting is reviewed, and justice is indeed rendered in almost all cases. You may not agree with every verdict, but there is rule of law. Unless your idea of justice is a Palestinian firing squad or lynch mob. To say that NONE have been brought to justice is a bald faced lie.&lt;/em&gt;

While it is certainly true that Israel investigates all shootings and in some cases, individual soldiers are convicted, more often than not the IDF will seek out every possible excuse to justify the soldier's actions, even when they are completely indefensible.  

Looking at the history of indictments against IDF soldiers, at least one trend is very clear:  If the shooter is Ashkenazi or Mizrachi, chances are, the IDF will dismiss the charges out right.  However, if the shooter is Bedouin, Druze or Ethiopian, they might just end up in jail.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>The IDF has had hundreds of court-martials and scores of jail sentences against its own soldiers for shootings against civilians since 2000. Every single shooting is reviewed, and justice is indeed rendered in almost all cases. You may not agree with every verdict, but there is rule of law. Unless your idea of justice is a Palestinian firing squad or lynch mob. To say that NONE have been brought to justice is a bald faced lie.</em></p>
<p>While it is certainly true that Israel investigates all shootings and in some cases, individual soldiers are convicted, more often than not the IDF will seek out every possible excuse to justify the soldier&#8217;s actions, even when they are completely indefensible.  </p>
<p>Looking at the history of indictments against IDF soldiers, at least one trend is very clear:  If the shooter is Ashkenazi or Mizrachi, chances are, the IDF will dismiss the charges out right.  However, if the shooter is Bedouin, Druze or Ethiopian, they might just end up in jail.</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28851</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Apr 2008 15:13:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28851</guid>
		<description>According to my insider source in the US Navy, the most important and brilliant thing Bill Clinton did while in office was ensure a high degree of economic cooperation and engagement with China.  This was based on an analysis that China would want and need war for its own reasons within 20 years, unless the economic reasons became so compelling that it would choose a less bellicose path.  This was also based on an analysis that, despite technological superiority, the US cannot defeat China in a war (nor can Japan, nor Russia, nor Taiwan or India or Vietnam.  Only a nuke would defeat China, and nobody wants to go there either).  

China is a quarter of the world, and the more engaged that population is with the rest of the planet, the more it will have to lose, the more educated it will be, and the more likely it will be to committ to peaceful coexistence.  Given that neither the will nor ability exists to stop it, China's actions in Tibet are like Russia's in Chechnya.  Taking a stand against China in Tibet WITHOUT TEETH would only embitter it and make it belligerent-- making real war, over Taiwan or whatever-- far more likely.  Do the math.

aside to xisnotx: The IDF has had hundreds of court-martials and scores of jail sentences against its own soldiers for shootings against civilians since 2000.  Every single shooting is reviewed, and justice is indeed rendered in almost all cases.  You may not agree with every verdict, but there is rule of law.  Unless your idea of justice is a Palestinian firing squad or lynch mob.  To say that NONE have been brought to justice is a bald faced lie.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>According to my insider source in the US Navy, the most important and brilliant thing Bill Clinton did while in office was ensure a high degree of economic cooperation and engagement with China.  This was based on an analysis that China would want and need war for its own reasons within 20 years, unless the economic reasons became so compelling that it would choose a less bellicose path.  This was also based on an analysis that, despite technological superiority, the US cannot defeat China in a war (nor can Japan, nor Russia, nor Taiwan or India or Vietnam.  Only a nuke would defeat China, and nobody wants to go there either).  </p>
<p>China is a quarter of the world, and the more engaged that population is with the rest of the planet, the more it will have to lose, the more educated it will be, and the more likely it will be to committ to peaceful coexistence.  Given that neither the will nor ability exists to stop it, China&#8217;s actions in Tibet are like Russia&#8217;s in Chechnya.  Taking a stand against China in Tibet WITHOUT TEETH would only embitter it and make it belligerent&#8211; making real war, over Taiwan or whatever&#8211; far more likely.  Do the math.</p>
<p>aside to xisnotx: The IDF has had hundreds of court-martials and scores of jail sentences against its own soldiers for shootings against civilians since 2000.  Every single shooting is reviewed, and justice is indeed rendered in almost all cases.  You may not agree with every verdict, but there is rule of law.  Unless your idea of justice is a Palestinian firing squad or lynch mob.  To say that NONE have been brought to justice is a bald faced lie.</p>
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		<title>By: xisnotx</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28726</link>
		<dc:creator>xisnotx</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Mar 2008 08:29:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28726</guid>
		<description>Bob-- i'm not really sure why you're asking that. The answer is simple -- it's never ok to target civilians.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bob&#8211; i&#8217;m not really sure why you&#8217;re asking that. The answer is simple &#8212; it&#8217;s never ok to target civilians.</p>
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		<title>By: Diz</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28718</link>
		<dc:creator>Diz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Mar 2008 00:37:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28718</guid>
		<description>i think these pictures are horrible yet i understand why they lash out. years of abuse and they give it back in return but i don't think it really matter who it is they kill for the so long as its "the other side"... shame but thats how it is in my opinion. Much like Ireland as bog pointed out. humanity at its worst.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i think these pictures are horrible yet i understand why they lash out. years of abuse and they give it back in return but i don&#8217;t think it really matter who it is they kill for the so long as its &#8220;the other side&#8221;&#8230; shame but thats how it is in my opinion. Much like Ireland as bog pointed out. humanity at its worst.</p>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28717</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Mar 2008 00:31:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28717</guid>
		<description>xisnotx, what about Hamas? It's ok for THEM to deliberately target civilians?? Maybe Israel should use the exact same rockets and point them back in similar trajectories in an eye for eye fashion AND send people with bombs strapped to themselves to explode in populated cafes???</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>xisnotx, what about Hamas? It&#8217;s ok for THEM to deliberately target civilians?? Maybe Israel should use the exact same rockets and point them back in similar trajectories in an eye for eye fashion AND send people with bombs strapped to themselves to explode in populated cafes???</p>
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		<title>By: Non American</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28715</link>
		<dc:creator>Non American</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Mar 2008 22:57:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28715</guid>
		<description>Well, what have we learned here? That the Chinese (Han) regime is authoritarian and brutal? Nah, we already knew that. Perhaps that noone is willing to actively intervene? Nah, we already knew that. I could go on....

My simple point is this: China has been this way for thousands of years, righly or wrongly, and the words we say or actions we take, aside from direct intervention, mean nothing to them. Their belief in their own importance, destiny and greatness based on their preception of their own past is akin only really to the rise of the 3rd Reich.

Tibet was once part of the Chinese empire. Separate state to be sure, but part of their ancient empire. China these days sees that ancient empire as their desired country, hence the one China policy. The Han chinese will do what they want to with the 'empire' because they see it as theirs, and our opinions dont count because they were there a long time before us, and expect to be there a long time after we are gone.

Sad but true.

If this were the cold war, and Tibet offered the opportunity for it, you would I imagine see another Afghanistan develop to simply drain Chinas' resources and economy. However, since so many companies now depend on China for manufacturing this will never be.

Your only alternative really would be to develop replacement capabilities in India, or to develop them in Africa. Personally I would like to see Africa get some of the ecomomic development and investment it sorely needs. I am sure that there are many places willing to take Chinas' place, if only they had the opportunity. But would it stop the occupation of Tibet? Maybe for a time...

Non American</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, what have we learned here? That the Chinese (Han) regime is authoritarian and brutal? Nah, we already knew that. Perhaps that noone is willing to actively intervene? Nah, we already knew that. I could go on&#8230;.</p>
<p>My simple point is this: China has been this way for thousands of years, righly or wrongly, and the words we say or actions we take, aside from direct intervention, mean nothing to them. Their belief in their own importance, destiny and greatness based on their preception of their own past is akin only really to the rise of the 3rd Reich.</p>
<p>Tibet was once part of the Chinese empire. Separate state to be sure, but part of their ancient empire. China these days sees that ancient empire as their desired country, hence the one China policy. The Han chinese will do what they want to with the &#8216;empire&#8217; because they see it as theirs, and our opinions dont count because they were there a long time before us, and expect to be there a long time after we are gone.</p>
<p>Sad but true.</p>
<p>If this were the cold war, and Tibet offered the opportunity for it, you would I imagine see another Afghanistan develop to simply drain Chinas&#8217; resources and economy. However, since so many companies now depend on China for manufacturing this will never be.</p>
<p>Your only alternative really would be to develop replacement capabilities in India, or to develop them in Africa. Personally I would like to see Africa get some of the ecomomic development and investment it sorely needs. I am sure that there are many places willing to take Chinas&#8217; place, if only they had the opportunity. But would it stop the occupation of Tibet? Maybe for a time&#8230;</p>
<p>Non American</p>
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		<title>By: xisnotx</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28706</link>
		<dc:creator>xisnotx</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Mar 2008 13:41:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28706</guid>
		<description>mmm, i'd say a point about expectations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>mmm, i&#8217;d say a point about expectations.</p>
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		<title>By: Mobius</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28695</link>
		<dc:creator>Mobius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Mar 2008 04:06:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28695</guid>
		<description>bog - xisnotx is applying zionist platitudes to the plight of the tibetans in order to make a point about the moral turpitude of israel's supporters.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>bog - xisnotx is applying zionist platitudes to the plight of the tibetans in order to make a point about the moral turpitude of israel&#8217;s supporters.</p>
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		<title>By: Ray</title>
		<link>http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28650</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Mar 2008 01:05:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://orthodoxanarchist.com/2008/03/19/i-hate-to-do-this-but/#comment-28650</guid>
		<description>I don't think oppression gives anyone the right to assault innocent people. In the marketplace of ideas, once you resort to violence, whatever point you had or were trying to make is null and void. Just my 2 cents, take it for what it's worth (about 2 cents, but I also find pacifism immoral, so what the hey)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think oppression gives anyone the right to assault innocent people. In the marketplace of ideas, once you resort to violence, whatever point you had or were trying to make is null and void. Just my 2 cents, take it for what it&#8217;s worth (about 2 cents, but I also find pacifism immoral, so what the hey)</p>
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